A: We've been doing a lot of listening over the last four or five years. After the 1998 election we were thinking very hard about what kind of a government Bermuda needs to move it forward in the 21st Century. There are a couple of things we learned very quickly. One is that it's very important to put the interests of Bermuda first over the interests of any political party or any personal agendas that we might have within our party.

The other lesson we learned is that in order for Bermuda to be successful and prosperous going forward, everybody in Bermuda has to feel that they can participate fully in Bermuda's success. So those are a couple of the very key points that we have been hearing over the last few years.

What we are also hearing from people is that people want a government that's based on values as well. I think that one of the first things we reaffirmed as a party after we got together and thought about working as a group over the last few years and added new people, is that government needs to be based on core values. And those are values of integrity, openness, mutual respect and fairness. Those are very much a part of our vision. And I think a third part of our vision is what we've been calling 'One Bermuda'. And we feel very strongly that Bermuda really needs to come together to properly address a lot of these key issues that we are facing - whether it's affordable housing, whether it's healthcare for seniors or doing a better job at dealing with the menace of drugs. Or addressing changes to the criminal justice system which will make it more effective and certainly more responsive to the needs of the community at this point.

A:Yes

A:First of all we have a lot of new members. If you look at 1998, about half the members we have had in the House since 1998 are new people. And since we put out this list of new candidates that we've put out today, I think you'll find that more than half are also new people who have come on board since 1998. I think what we've got is a remarkable and very diverse group. We've got golf pros, we've got Ministers, we've got business people, we've got people that are very very grassroots, like Kenny Bascome, Gerald Fubler. We've got people like Hillary Soares, who is an ex nurse and has worked very hard on behalf of seniors. We've got some experienced people as well - people who have served in Cabinet before.

I think our feeling is that this very diverse mix of people which in many respects is representative of Bermuda, is going to be able to come forward with plans and solutions which will be much more effective in terms of addressing a lot of the challenges Bermuda faces going forward.

It's the diversity that gives us strength. I think it's also fair to say we have a lot of candidates who are very grounded. They've joined us because they are very committed to working to produce a better Bermuda for all of us today. They share as all of us do, a lot of the frustrations, a lot of the trials that comes from living in Bermuda in this day and age. They are parents, they see education issues, they see housing issues. And they are going to be very strong in making sure that we actually address these issues that people are continually telling us need to be addressed.

A:I think we've become more diverse. Because we've got a lot more new people than we had before. And I think in political parties, turnover, new blood, new energy is what's needed to really make sure that you are grounded, and that you're listening and that you are understanding of what the needs of people and what the needs of the country are. So that's where I think we have been very successful in putting together a team which has this diversity. So that's one issue - new faces.

A:The second issue is that we have reaffirmed some of the values that we think are important in good government - that is fairness, integrity and mutual respect. And the third is we have worked with a lot of these new candidates and indeed a broader cross section of the community to effectively come up with some solutions and ideas which we think will be effective going forward. For example, Hillary Soares was one of the ones who said 'look, I'm dealing with a lot of seniors right now and they are really struggling in many cases to be able to afford visits to doctors, the HIP programme is not providing the kind of coverage they need. They're having to choose sometimes between doctors visits, or rent money, paying the Belco bill. They're having to choose between food sometimes and medical coverage as well'. She said it would be very useful for those who don't have adequate medical coverage if we could actually pilot a seniors clinic for them to be able to get the kind of preventative care that might actually prevent them from getting into more difficult medical problems because of lack of medical care.

A:We really don't know what their policies are at this point. They haven't shared them. I think one of the things that we have been doing over the last six months is we've been laying out a lot of our ideas and a lot of our plans in housing, seniors care. We've talked about free medicine for those seniors who can't financially afford it. We've talked about a three step plan in housing which begins with the issue of addressing the emergency housing plan.

A:I think a lot of things that the Progressive Labour Party has done over the last four of five years were simply continuations of programmes that had already started under the United Bermuda Party government.

A:Well some of them are and some of them aren't. I mean we have to give credit in some respects -twice a day (week) is certainly not a suggestion which came out of the United Bermuda Party.

I have to give them credit for the single seat constitutional change. I don't like the way they approached it because it was done in what I would say is standard style - which is arrogant, it was shrouded in secrecy, it was thrust upon people. The Bermudian people did not get a chance to ratify those recommendations through a referendum which I think was very important. They simply proceeded on it.

A:I think the challenge that we have, and this is not my perspective, what I'm hearing out there is from people that I've talked to in canvassing and meeting and talking to on the doorstep, they simply haven't addressed, they haven't delivered on a lot of the core needs of this community. They have had five years to address the issue of affordable housing and they haven't. They haven't addressed the needs of seniors. I think there's a lot of concern out there. It's a clich?, but there's this deterioration of the social fabric. We really haven't put the support behind the ATI initiative which was originally a United Bermuda Party initiative with the Drugs Court. Those are things which simply haven't delivered.

People are telling me on a regular basis they can't afford to rent a house. Young Bermudians are saying to me 'I don't think I'll ever be able to own a piece of the rock'. Seniors are saying 'we simply aren't getting adequate kind of care. My pension isn't sufficient to be able to cover my rent and my Belco bill and food.' These are core issues which have not been delivered upon.

A:I think as I said to you we have what is not only a very representative group in Bermuda which I think is going to be a much better group to be able to understand and to work to pull people together to address some of these issues that in some cases have been really been exacerbated over the last four or five years. Affordable housing was an issue that cropped up just before the last election. But if you go back to 1994/95, when the base properties were coming back, affordable housing was not the issue it was in 1998 or even more of a problem in 2003. The simple reason was a lot of housing was being vacated by servicemen who were living up in Southampton area, living in St. David's and St. George's.

Prior to that the United Bermuda Party was quite successful in dealing with affordable housing. If you go back to the mid 80s when there was a problem and also to the early 90s when there was a problem, the United Bermuda Party was effective in not only producing a response through the Bermuda Housing Corporation which was why it was created in the first place, but also getting the level of new housing units being built up to about 500 to 600 a year. It's currently down to around 200. I think one of the things that's very clear here is that Government cannot do all the housing - it can't build itself. We've got to have the private sector being involved in producing some of the housing.

A:That's only the start.

A:The issue is the types of homes. There were plans that were put when we left in 1998...

A:The budget at that point was in the order of $20 million, .. in terms of financing package.

A:It's difficult to say. We've been working with architects and contractors to look at modular housing, to look at prefabricated housing. And probably more importantly also looking at financial institutions to be able to get the interest rate down from the seven or eight percent are looking at now, to closer to four percent. We think that's entirely feasible. That would make a big difference in terms of the cost for both affordable rental and for affordable purchase.

A:There's two pieces on this. One is the Housing Corporation could certainly float a bond issue. The other is that housing as we saw back then could certainly be financed over a longer period of time through rents or through other sorts of revenue streams coming back into the Housing Corporation. It's entirely feasible. What's more important right now, I think is, the challenge we have right now, is that it's not just emergency housing. There are a lot of young Bermudians who simply don't feel they are able to get onto the housing ladder. What we need to do is we need to be able to inject into the housing market a much larger number of affordable homes. Those may not be typical Bermudian cottages on a half an acre of land. They may be condominiums, they may be sort of townhouse complexes, they may be more cluster housing. And they also may be built with non-conventional methods to get the cost down to make them more affordable. All those things, with financing packages are things that we've looked at and we think they are entirely feasible.

A: Yes.

A:As was the drugs court.

A:I think it' s a very simple answer. The challenge that ATI is facing right now and the Bermuda Assessment Referral Centre is facing and other treatment services is that they haven't been getting the resources they require to perform effectively and that's the message we've been getting back loud and clear.

A:From people who have been involved in this process. It is not being supported. It is not getting the kind of longer term resources and emphasis that it needs to make it function properly.

A:It's money but I think it's also making sure that the implementation is being done properly and it's being supported. You've got to believe in these things as well, it's not a question of lip service.

A:Yes.

A:Well, I think the Progressive Labour Party did follow through on the seniors office that we had suggested some time ago. But I think again, getting back to a comment Mr. Cox made the other day, he said that 'down the road' the Progressive Labour Party will be looking at Contributory Pensions, which is social insurance. And also the new national pension scheme which was essentially part of the United Bermuda Party's planning.

The problem we have is that seniors can't wait till we get 'down the road'. There are a lot of seniors right now who are having a great deal of difficulty of making ends meet. We said when the national pension scheme was first put to the House ... we said that we had to look very quickly to see how that combination of national pension scheme and contributory pension might work together. Because there were a lot of seniors that were retiring just before that or after that that could have benefited from the national pension scheme. So we have to find a way to see whether we can provide a better safety net for those seniors.

A:Of course we did. And that's exactly why...

A:Absolutely. If you go back to the early 90s one of the reasons why we essentially moved forward on the national pension scheme was we recognised that the contributory pension fund was not going to be sufficient. It was never meant to be the only source of support after retirement. We realised at that time that we had to put in place a comprehensive national pension scheme which would give Bermudians when they retire a reasonable income to be able to support themselves on. And that was..

A:Studies were done.They were done. There was a Green paper, that I think came out in 1994, which said the senior population was going to increase dramatically over the next 25 or 30 years and we've got to put in place a programme which will address that. Otherwise we were going to have real problems. And I think you could see it in other places as well - Japan and a lot of European countries - a growing problem with the overall pension scheme a lot of which were government funded.

A:Absolutely and...

A:There was a fair amount of movement on some of those.

A:Well I think you had things like seniors housing, you had Purvis Park and you had other plans. But I think it's not so much a question of going back and looking at what was done or wasn't done. I think what we need to do is look forward and tackle these issues that are squarely in front of us right now.

A:Well I'm not sure that we failed...

A:I think they did.

A:I think we are now at a point where the Progressive Labour Party has a record and I think Bermudians will probably take a hard look and see whether they addressed a lot of the challenges that Bermudians said were important. And what I'm hearing is that people are disappointed, they're feeling betrayed because a lot of those issues have not been adequately addressed.

A:Well I think it's fair to say that most people think of us as good managers. Where I think they didn't feel we were being effective is perhaps we were not listening quite as carefully as we might have. I think that's one of the nice things about being in Opposition: You have a chance to listen very carefully about what the country needs in order to be able to solve some of the problems. As I said before I think the way in which these things are going to have to be addressed and being effective in trying to find solutions which really unite the country as opposed to dividing it a whole lot.

A:I think most Bermudians would say we have not had good management over the last five years.

A:I can tell you what's most important here. It's not so much figures. We can talk about figures in a second but I think it's what people are feeling out there. What people are feeling is that there's a widening gap between the haves and have nots. When I'm canvassing a lot of people are saying they are really struggling. You have a lot of families some of them are headed by single mothers who are having a great deal difficulty in meeting their rents, in meeting their electric bills. There's a lot of frustration and a lot of anxiety out there because they're not coping.

What we're also seeing is that as a consequence of a lot of the spending that's going on the level or the burden of taxes has gone up appreciably. If you want a number, what you see is that this fiscal year Bermudians are paying $100 million more a year than they did in 1998. Land tax has gone up appreciably. What I've heard is there are a lot of people who are having a lot of difficulty in making ends meet because their land tax may have gone from $1000 to $2,000 a year or from $4,000 to $8,000. In many cases land tax has almost effectively doubled. And we know that Mr. Cox has in fact tried to readjust land tax for seniors three times and I can tell you there are a lot of seniors out there that can tell you they are really suffering still. So it's really what people are telling me.

I think what we are seeing is that there are outward signs of prosperity in a lot of areas but if you look at what has happened in the hospitality industry particularly over the last four or five years, you're seeing a lot of people that are suffering. We know that since 1999, we've lost roughly 1,000 Bermudian jobs and we've gained something on the order of 450 to 500 non-Bermudian jobs.

A:Well it's very simple. What's happened with the economy is you've had a dramatic shift - in the mid 1990s tourism and international business were contributing roughly the same amounts to the economy. By the end of 2001 international business was three times the contribution that tourism was making. You've lost 700 to 800 jobs in the hospitality sector since 1998 and a lot or a significant amount or probably the equivalent amount in the restaurants or the service area as well.

What the United Bermuda Party is suggesting is we need to as quickly as we can, diversify this economy. We are dangerously dependent on international business right now. Yes it's very important and we've got to be careful in terms of maintaining it and making sure that we support it, but we also got to broaden the economy as well.

And we've suggested there should be a very, very different way in terms of how we manage the economy. We're proposing a Ministry of Economic Development which would be much more proactive in terms of looking at ways to help invigorate the tourism area through a Tourism Authority which would take the politics out... What we're also proposing as part of this new Ministry of Economic Development is an Office of Economic Empowerment because we think it's very important when we look for new business, new proposals whether it be for the baselands or to reinvigorate the Hamilton waterfront or to make our hospitality product more exciting that we actively look for ways to get Bermudians and Bermuda businesses involved in the process. So this office of economic empowerment is going to be continually looking to find ways to make sure that, as I said to you before this is a very important piece that we believe in - that Bermudians must be able to all share in the success going forward and we need to be continually looking to make sure that happens in a very proactive way.

There are some other things there - there's a lot of government business that could be distributed more effectively to small business. There are a lot of things we can do with the Small Business Development Corporation to assist in terms of helping to find venture money, to help small businesses with financing. We also think there's a lot that can be done to assist small businesses particularly in terms of bidding for Government contracts so there's an active programme to help them do that kind of thing. What's really important is we've got to get tourism back to a point where it's functioning as really one of the twin pillars. If you look at the last four or five years, we've literally lost something of the order of $300 million from the economy because tourism has dropped so dramatically.

A:I talked about diversification of the economy.

A:Diversification. And the first step clearly is the hospitality/tourism business. We've lost tremendous opportunities with Club Med which we need to get that space moved forward on. And I mean there's been proposals that's been sitting there two or three years.

Probably what will happen is that government will in the next week or two try and pull a bunny out of a hat and say that they've got a proposal they now want to move forward on. But it's too late. We've lost tremendous time on baselands and Morgan's Point. We've lost time with this Par-la-Ville hotel in Hamilton. There are a lot of opportunities which we haven't been able to follow through on.

I think it's also fair to say, while on the surface international business looks like it's healthy, and it's very important to be healthy because there are probably about 3,500 people working in that industry . The majority of those are Bermudian and we've got to make sure that they continue to be employed and that they work well. But what we've seen over the last three or four years is that when you look at new registrations, new incorporations added to the register on an annual basis, what you've seen is that the number of new registrations in international businesses peaked out in 2001. And the growth actually has been declining every year since then. If you compare the end of 2001, versus the end of 2002, you will see that it's almost an equivalent number in terms of companies on the register.

So you've seen a real trend behind the numbers over the last three years in terms of slowing down new international business incorporations.

A:Well you don't build up the economy by tearing down or having one of the pillars essentially decline. That's been our problem with tourism. You want to make sure that international business is stable, that it is growing because there are a huge number of not only direct jobs for young Bermudians but also there are service industries and supporting industries which depend on international business to be successful. What I'm saying is you need to be able to broaden the economy, reinvigorate tourism and look for ways in which you can diversify international business and provide the kinds of job opportunities.

A:I don't think it's a contradiction at all. What I'm saying is you want to send a very strong message to international business that we support it and we're very sensitive to the challenges that they face both in terms of the cost of doing business here and also in terms of the international regulators. But I think at the same time, we've got to get tourism back to the point where tourism is effectively providing the kinds of jobs and the kinds of opportunities for Bermudians.

A:What I want personally is not important. What I think is important is that Bermudians are really the ones who as a group need to be clear sense of whether they think it's important and that's why we've consistently said we don't think independence should be mixed in with an election because it's too important an issue to be confused with a lot of other issues which come up in a general election. It's an issue which should be put to the Bermudian public in a referendum and probably most importantly there should be adequate discussion and a lot of information given to people so they can make up their minds.

A:Quite frankly I don't see an overwhelming groundswell from the public that is putting independence on the front-burner. What I am hearing is that there are much more pressing issues. And we've talked about those. Housing, crime and drugs, education are pressing issues. Independence right now is not a pressing issue.

A:I'm not sure that's true. In the past there have been instances where candidates have had very strong personal views on independence.

A:As we see it independence is not a pressing issue in this campaign. I think the party's position is that there will be people in the United Bermuda Party who probably are both for and against independence. But I can tell you it is not an issue which has come up in any sort of major way at caucus. As I said to you quite emphatically we think that there are a lot of other issues which are much more important and deal with basic quality of life right now.

A: They know where we stand on the issue and that is...

A:I think if people get asked the question in people's living rooms or on their back porch or on the street, where do they stand on independence I think they are quite prepared to give it.

A:I haven't told anybody they're not allowed to tell the press. What I am telling you is right now my particular position on independence is not important. What probably is important coming from me is saying that we think it is really important that it is decided as a separate issue by the Bermudian people when they feel that it is time to do it. It could be internal issues that bring it up again or it could be external issues. We could be pushed into a position where independence is the only way forward for Bermuda because of pressure that we are getting from the United Kingdom or because of external factors. My own personal view is that Bermuda will some time go independent. I can't say when that will be.

A:I can't imagine why. No one has been told as far as I know. I certainly haven't told anybody when people are asked about independence not to talk about it. What would be fair is as I've just said to you we don't see it as an important issue right now.

A:I think the issue of independence comes up on a fairly regular basis every few years and I think when it comes up it's certainly very easy to start preparing for it. I think a lot of information has to be put forward in much the same way that the green paper was put forward on independence I think in the early 90s.

A:I think housing and the issue of affordable housing affects everybody - both on the rental side and for people who like to own their own home. We've been doing a lot of thinking about it and talked to a lot of people and we've got plans. I think education is also very important. We are in a service economy, a lot of people - you've seen the move toward home-schools - a lot of people are struggling to put their kids in private schools. I think the education system is something that also needs to be addressed. I think our position is a series of initiatives - one of those is to put much more of the authority in the hands of the school teachers. We think that we need to do a much better job integrating things like music, theatre, arts into the school curriculum. We think we need to give at the secondary level some real choices in terms of what I would call a technical education. The Bermuda Technical Institute when it was merged with the sixth form centre - and some of the other pieces a number of years ago - we effectively lost that option for technical education. Not everybody wants to be an academic. We need to get standards up and we need to make sure that parents are much more involved with the schools to be able to support their kids and know how individual schools are performing so that results of standardised tests need to be made available.

A:Again that was an initiative of the United Bermuda Party. In fairness what we heard from Paula Cox in the Throne Speech was that they were going to consolidate school boards. We think it's very important that each of the schools have a board so that parents can be much more involved in their children's education. You've got to have that accountability at the board level.

A:I think it's a difference. Yes. I think tourism is another area where we are very different.We have been very consistent in saying we need to take the politics out of it. We need to work on an authority sort of basis and we need to be much more proactive and not treading water in terms of our economy.

A:I don't think about it in terms of biggest donors because we've been getting very widespread support. It's been gratifying, a lot of it is coming from individuals, and it's coming in in varying amounts. We've been getting support from local businesses.

A:Well that's one of the reasons why we think it's very important to have a Freedom of Information Act for the next government and also to be able to have a Code of Conduct for Members of Parliament.

A:There is no requirement right now to make the names of people known. And I think, you know, one of the challenges we've got is people feel very intimidated in terms of saying who they're supporting and who they're not supporting. And what I can tell you is that I've worked very hard on a number of occasions and what I've found is as a consequence of my efforts I'll get a cheque but they'll also send an equal amount to the Progressive Labour Party. But I think it's fair to say a lot of people are disappointed over the last few years and as a consequence I think they are very concerned that it's very difficult to raise money as an Opposition, it's much easier to raise money as a government. They are very concerned that there will be a balance there so we will at least have a chance to spend money on things like inserts and other costs involved in mounting a campaign.

A:It's not something that's on the tip of my tongue. And I think it's also something that I won't talk about in that sense.

A:Well I won't say that because there's no level playing field here. I think the people are very concerned. I've told you who's funding the campaign - it's a very broad cross section of the community - individuals, local business, international business, and it's probably in many respects not much different than what we've seen over the last few elections. There's generally broad spread support. And some people are sort of more concerned, others feel they should give something because they think it's important to provide a balance but I think what we probably need to do is look at the issue of campaign financing. But I think right now people have given money to a party on the basis that they don't want to be singled out for retribution by a government that they feel can be quite vengeful.

A:Well, I think at this point we are now Associate Members. I think quite frankly for us it's a question of priorities. And associate membership in Caricom is a much lower priority than all the other issues. And what we've seen is that Caricom is the kind of association which would probably require lots of trips, lots of time, which could be much better spent in other places. I think Caricom is much more aggressively moving toward a single market economy. And that's certainly is not in Bermuda's long term interests.

A:No. I think we have been opposed to membership in Caricom for the simple reason that we felt that it didn't bring us any additional value in many respects, than we were getting in sporting and other ties, historically. There's only so much time and so much money and given a choice I think we'd much rather spend that energy and that money and that time working on domestic issues which are important and also to making sure that associations with extremely important trading partners like the United States are addressed.

A:It's certainly something that's very possible. We'd have to have a look at it. At this point because of lack of transparency we don't understand all of the requirements and the issues that are there.

A:I think there's sometimes a tendency to blame things on the media. There's an old expression 'if you can's stand the heat get out of the kitchen'. There are certainly have been articles and stories from time to time that we did not think showed the proper kind of balance but on other occasions I think we've benefited as well. My general sense is that I think we have to be accountable.